@Nari



I think it should be understandable why trans women usually don't want to be likened to cis crossdressing men, or otherwise reduced to their appearance and genitalia, but you do you. As long as you recognize that isn't most people's cup of tea.



I'm not gonna say "this is probably not how Sakura is going to stay considering the evidence" because that's a whole other argument but I believe that the translator giving a definitive one-sided label to a character who is questioning their identity, one that hasn't been given by the author or the story, is a bad idea, because it can... well, end up to be wrong.

@EvelynIsGone well im just going to assume the TL misused the terms, im not going to berate them for it, its not something hard to misues especially when a lot of transppl like myself dont mind being called a trap (i personally find it a compliment, since the definition of a trap implies that one actually passes as a girl, which for someone trying to pass is a compliment)
though more education should be given around the terms and when its appropriate to use them, i think that in the current point of time calling sakura a trap isnt bad as iirc sakura does not really want to be a girl (atleast, not right now they dont seem to know what they want) but amane definately shouldnt be called a reverse trap (unless they dont mind it, but we cant know that)

@Nari



I think you just answered the question yourself. Trans people face unique circumstances. So that makes this a unique story. And I believe this is one that has a great understanding and sympathy for its characters.



i seriously doubt that



I'm not suggesting the TL hates trans people. I don't think anyone here is. Just that labeling these characters "trap" and "reverse trap" is inaccurate to what they are. The TL can just have misinterpreted these characters, or perhaps just misused the terms here. It's not an uncommon thing.



@Kaarme lmao

@EvelynIsGone



i believe they meant "outside perspective" storywise, the other characters in the story seeing them on their dates


dont get me wrong, im literally a Transwoman myself, i know the nuances in the community, however i, as a transwoman, do not feel the joke was targeted at me myself, but rather at the concept that in 2019 we are now getting "straight dating with a plottwist!" .. i personally love genderbending and crossdressing manga/anime/novels, but even i feel weird about all these novels, it makes me feel like a commodity, like my situation is being used as a sort of "joke" or "plottwist" .... why write a story where the girl is AMAB and the guy is AFAB? the situation would be no different to a AFAB girl x AMAB boy to outsiders, its just a boy and a girl dating (granted some unique circumstances)

idk, maybe its my autism kicking in, but the last page did not seem like a joke about the story in particular but rather the concept in the anime industry itself for writing a lot about trans characters (almost always called "traps or crossdressers" by the industry)

think about it, if the TL really had bad intentions about the stories characters, why would they TL it? idk about you, but i wouldnt TL a story with characters i didnt like or thought ill of

@Denrick19 Yeah, it certainly wasn't my brightest day, I was like a n00b getting pulled along by a troll like that. Fortunately EvelynIsGone lost their edge towards the end, which returned my wits to me.

@Evelynisgone Thinking about it You're totally right here actually the joke probably should have been put in a actual trap x reverse trap thing considering that trans people would probably be put off by having a it in a.....trans manga.

My bad

@Denrick19 I mean, I just think that if you're trans, and you've personally been compared to a crossdresser by people who dislike you (which isn't an uncommon thing at all for people to go through), it's not cool to see it happening again, even as a joke, yeah? And it's probably even less cool to see here of all places, considering the manga's content.

Not saying you have to personally be offended by it or anything, you're probably not personally affected by any of this shit at all, just explaining how it's not unreasonable for other people to be.

@EvelynIsGone @rhodiridium I can totally see why someone can find the joke insensitive rude and stupid, I didn't find it funny but I don't find it to be something to really care about. I'm just more tolerant to edgy/unfunny humor then most people probably not to the point of defending using a slur, but to the extent of something like this chapter.

Different jokes for different folks I guess

It's stupid, insensitive, and rude; to see just how awful it really is go look at the other TL page for this chapter and compare the two. One is wholesome, cute, and supportive of LGBTQ+ people, the other is a shitty overused joke made at the expense of an oppressed minority.

P.S. This isn't the first time Kaarme has posted such transphobic bullshit in the comments on this series. Idk what the moderation policy is but I suggest y'all report and ignore.

I don't think anyone believed it wasn't a joke, it was literally in a meme format, just that it was one in poor taste given the context. It's easy to find the joke funny when it's about some cis dude dressing up as a girl for whatever reason, but kinda disrespectful when it's a story about a trans boy and a possible trans girl. It's grouping trans people in with people who crossdress by choice, should be obvious why that isn't everyone's cup of tea.

Kaarme went full clown LMAO

Imo it was a joke and it doesn't get any deeper. like "He prob didn't read it" why the fuck would you translate something and not read the previous chapters?

@Kaarme sorry i called you a mean name, i assumed you weren't 5 and could handle it

@EvelynIsGone


Thanks for finishing this dicussion for both of us.

@Kaarme you don't need to "write at length" anything you just need to not make up shitty definitions that i can easily poke holes in



no

This may come as a surprise to you but trans guys are guys even pre-HRT, that doesn't suddenly just start being a thing. If you disagree you're free to take this up with every major scientific institution in the world, which all support this conclusion, though i'm sure that will be a fruitless effort for you

And the rest of your post is predicated on this belief so I might as well not even address the rest of the times you essentially repeat this statement



as if to further solidify that you're a complete idiot you say something like this. no one in the world holds this belief. this is just the biggest straw man possible.



he's pretending to be a girl at school and home. he's not a "part-time female." he's doing something for his own safety in life, because if he went to his parents and said "i'm gonna live as a boy now" they might not be accepting and it could ruin his life.



woah dude be careful not to cut yourself on that edge bruh

@EvelynIsGone I need to write at length for a simple thing when you in fact know perfectly well what I'm talking about? Sorry, but that would be too childish.

Amane is (for the time being) a girl who looks like a boy on their dates. Sakura is a boy who looks like a girl on their dates. Just look at the cover page of this manga. That's a reverse trap and a trap by the definition of those words, especially as far as the joke was concerned. It was a self-contained joke. This manga also began with a long scene where nothing was explained, so technically a reader could start to read this randomly without knowing anything, all the way to the panel where Sakura removed his wig. It also reflect the joke quite well.

You don't become the opposite gender just by writing so in your diary. You also can't be part-time male, part-time female, which would be required for Amane to really be a man right now. "He" couldn't be a boy and still use the women's toilets and changing rooms at school. Not even his family knows how he feels. That's not really any way to establish yourself as the opposite gender. I have no idea what protocols and requirements Japan has for it to happen, but that's what it takes.

@Kaarme



maybe if they didn't read the story yes



this is such a shittily inaccurate description it's ridiculous. This could easily be applied to a number of situations that no one in their right mind would call a character a "trap" about. For instance, say there's a story where the characters hear a feminine name, assume it belongs to a girl, but then when they meet the person with that name it turns out to be a buff, hairy cis dude. That would by no means be a "trap," but by your definition it would apparently meet the criteria. or a transgender girl who looks masculine being revealed to be, in fact, a trans girl, rather than a cis guy. would you call that a "trap"? I think it would be a ridiculously inaccurate description of the character.

that's how vague and bad your description of the term is... and yet it still can't really be applied to amane because amane's gender matches the original appearance we got from the character. so despite your description being vague it can't even apply to one of the characters it was used for in any sense.

i might be able to give you sakura-- but the character is, at minimum, questioning their gender identity at this point in the story, so putting a definitive label of "this is a crossdresser" is just dumb at this point unless you have word of the author outside of the manga to support what you say.



trans =/= crossdressing

Can we just let the translator joke for once? yeesh be happy we got a new chapter

@EvelynIsGone Because that's what it was? It was a joke about the traditional boy meets girl setting getting no reaction out of those geezers, while the double convoluted setting left them shocked. From an outside observer's pov the MCs of this series are a trap and a reverse trap. A trap is nothing but a term to describe a situation where a character's real gender was suddenly revealed to the audience to be the opposite to what they believed. This matches Amane and Sakura 100% when they are on their dates, crossdressing.

@Nari Did we read the same page there? It specifically said "trap meets reverse trap love story," how the fuck did you gleam "oh they mean trap characters in anime in general" from that?